ericcoleman | So, let's talk about this here, since I made a flippant comment elsewhere

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convergence

So, let's talk about this here, since I made a flippant comment elsewhere

This started with a flippant comment on

philady's LJ, but it seems to have escalated, so I feel I should discuss it.

As some of you know, I do not attend Convergence

philady posted a poll here that said

Are you getting stoked for CONvergence?
Yes.
HELL YES!
I'm not going. I'm lame.

Me being me, I said

"I'm not going, the people who run Convergence are lame"

433 took exception to this, and for good reason.

So, the reason for my problems with Convergence go back several years. When I was trying to do the 12 cons in 12 months I contacted them to see about playing.

I have one rule when it comes to cons, if I contact a con about playing, it is my responsibility to pay for my badge. If they comp me, that's a good thing, but that is up to them.

If they contact me, they are contacting me as a pro. I don't make much of my living playing music, but I certainly do at least a little. Unless you are a tiny tiny con, you comp the pros. Period.

The next year I was contacted, please come play at the con. Cool. I had a good time the year before. Oh, if you want to do anything else, you have to buy a badge.

I said that I can't do that, you're asking me to drive there and play a show for no recompense except hopefully selling some CDs, I can't. I was nice about it, I do try to treat any venue I play with a good degree of professionalism, then the guy got all defensive and weird and went off on a rant about how it is not "pay to play" since I would get into my own show free.

I live 200+ miles away from the Twin Cities. At that point driving there and back cost me around 60 bucks. This guy asked me to play a free show that is costing me money, and tells me that it is not "pay to play". If I was local I suppose that I might have had a different reaction. I'm not.

The way I see this is like ... well ... if I was playing at a club, and they said, "sure, you can be on the stage, but if you want to go anywhere else you have to pay the cover charge".

It's a terrible way to treat people who you invite in to perform for and entertain YOUR guests. We are part of the show. You should show us respect. I think I may have had a different reaction if not for the "it's not pay to play thing". It would have just been left there, and I wouldn't go to Convergence. But the guy was an ass.

I know a little about the history of TC cons, and I know that there was a point where too many people got comped, things got out of control. But there is a point at which it is just silly.

So there is why I made my little flippant comment

433. It wasn't the best way to handle it, but maybe this will do some good. I have talked to other folks involved with Convergence about this, but nothing has come of it. It's a big con. You can do what you want because of that. But it does not serve the con well to treat people badly.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

We have a policy that pros are indeed comped if they sit a certain number of panels. Performances count as panels. If you had participated in panels about music, you would have been comped.

I'm sorry that it wasn't explained to you, and I'll bring that up with the head of Harmonic CONvergence and the incoming Events Director to make sure that it is explained better in the future. It is indeed bad form to ask someone to come from outside of the state and not explain the policies fully. I wish you had brought this up to someone running the con, so we could have explained it better.

However, I still take issue that you said "the people who run Convergence are lame". You seem to have had an issue with one volunteer out of a 100-person Concom and hundreds of other volunteers, yet you paint us all with the same brush.

Also, I will put forth that there are many musicians and bands who come and play, be it in HarmCON, Connie's Space Lounge, or Mainstage, who register just like everyone else. Some of them travel from great distances as well, further than Iowa.

When we started CONvergence, we wanted to make sure that the issues that happened at other conventions did not happen with us. Therefore, everyone registers save guests and pro panelists who sit a number of panels in their professional field. If a pro panelist is only attending for one or two panels, they receive a temp badge, not a full convention badge.

I'm sorry that we do not see eye-to-eye on this, and that you were not told all your options. We'll try to get better at that.

I wish you had brought this up to someone running the con, so we could have explained it better.

NO. You don't get to blame someone else.

He communicated with the person who had been designated to communicate the information to him. It was NOT his responsibility to find someone unknown to him to dispute given information.

I didn't say it was his responsibility, Emily, I said that I wished he had said something. Then, we could have handled the situation at the time rather than years down the line.

Communication is a problem, one that we have gotten better at over the years, but obviously still need to work on.

I said that I wished he had said something.

I did and I told you his reaction.

Maybe I'm not being clear.

What I wished you would have done is, having had a bad interaction with one of our volunteers, contacted their divisional director. I can see how that would be difficult not knowing the inner workings of the con, but hopefully we can make that a bit more transparent in the future. Like I said, I will bring up the situation and see what we can do to make sure confusion and bad feelings like this don't happen again (or at least happen LESS).

Are you actually saying that you expect people from out of state to figure out the structure of the convention and then find the appropriate person to complain to when the person who has been assigned the function of communicating information has already said his peace? How was he supposed to know that his concern would even be heard?

I don't even know why I'm responding to you, Emily. You're going to find fault in whatever I, or someone else you don't like, has to say.

If you'll notice, I wrote in that comment:

I can see how that would be difficult not knowing the inner workings of the con, but hopefully we can make that a bit more transparent in the future.

I don't even know why I'm responding to you, Emily. You're going to find fault in whatever I, or someone else you don't like, has to say.

To be quite fair, if you had just been a man about it and apologized without caveat at first, I still wouldn't have liked you and I would have figured that you were probably bullshitting something, but I would have let it go.

Now, of course the issue is that you act like a douchebag, and the underlying problem is obviously that I'm mean.

I don't know why you respond either.

Why not post some more private entries in your LJ? Or perhaps close off comments to the public ones again?

You can keep operating like that and think that you're right forever. I'm done with you.

Ha! At least I called you a bad name while you were still alive to defend yourself.

And people call ME the immature one!

Or should I have emailed it to 200 people?

Whoops, I'm sorry, that was me. I was logged out somehow.

Just so I understand your communication now - you're saying that when you used the word "wish," you had meant it in the more abstract "wishing for a million dollars" sort of way, rather than a recommendation as to how to handle such a situation in the future?

I'm responding to Eric himself.

I volunteered for panels as well. I expect to be put to work when I get let in free. I have been on panels of all sorts, ran sound for concerts, and all sorts of other things.

As I said though, my major problem is that the guy was an ass. That is who represented your con to me.

And I may not have been clear when I said that you took exception for my flippant comment, and for good reason. That was meant as an apology, I just didn't do it very well.

As for folks coming from all over, the last year I was there Luke was the only other person from out of town. The other acts were all local. This may have changed since then.

I agree, what you're describing sounds like the person you talked to didn't give you all the information, and again, I apologize for that. I hope we'll be able to do better in the future.

Hi!

I'm the incoming events Director, so I'd be the one responsible for Harmonic CONvergence starting in 2009. It's really too late to do anything about it for this year, obviously.

I apologize for any problems with our staff in the past. It is certainly not the way that I'd want these things to be communicated and will need to be improved for the future. I've noted it and will make sure that it is better communicated to our head of Harmonic CONvergence, our primary music space. We are stingy for comp memberships -- but it certainly sounds like you would more than satisfy our policy to get one.

I know that if you signed for panels as well as performed in Harmonic CONvergence, you'd qualify for a comp membership. I'll be willing to talk to you more about this in the future if you'd like -- I'd certainly like to see you return to our convention, and I'm sorry to hear about your experience.

If nothing else, I'd be happy to talk to you at Marscon next year about it, as I'm usually there at some point in the MISFITS party room, or via e-mail.

Michael Lee
michaell@michaell.org
CONvergence Events Director 2009

While this issue has been nearly talked out from every conceivable angle, I am the current CONvergence Events director and I would simply like to apologize to you for the poor way in which you were handled. This is the first I've heard of your issue so I apologize it wasn't addressed sooner.

I will not dodge the responsibility on this. I make a lot of decisions and it is extremely likely that the decision in this case was mine. At the very least, I failed to communicate the complete policy to my department head.

When we contact individuals who has performed in Harmonic CONvergence before, we do not consider it to be an invitation. We consider it to be a courtesy as most of the performers at that venue are local artists who are looking for a venue to perform. We are happy to provide them with that venue and we do not require them to register for the convention but we haven't considered what we do an "invitation."

That is, I think, our fault for the way we word that communication.

But we do have a comp policy in place that should have been communicated as I'm sure we could have made it fit for you.

Mike, my replacement, is obviously aware of this issue and will be working to address it in the coming year. I don't imagine that it will affect you but I hope that you understand we are human, we make mistakes and we do our best to learn from them.

This one is my fault. I take the blame for it and I regret that it will be someone else's job to fix it.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

So, let's talk about this here, since I made a flippant comment elsewhere

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obviously still need to work on

Re: obviously still need to work on

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